After the way we pulled out of Bagram in the dead of night without telling the Afghans, the handwriting on was on the wall. Even so, the ARVN certainly acquitted themselves better than the ANA.
@pkdphd - First, LBJ was the one who committed hundreds of thousands of American boys to the fight in Vietnam. Second, you should have been there during the Easter offensive in 1972; the ARVN fought like tigers. In 1975 after America had cut off all support for the Republic of Vietnam, even ammunition and spare parts (in direct violation of our treaty obligations) it was different, but it still took 5 months for the PAVN (with tanks and plenty of artillery) to take Saigon.
I had a friend who served in Korea and Nam. He was a solid Democrat. He had a newspaper front page tacked to a wall and it declared that America lost and pointed out why the loss was on the democrats. Yeah, that's right,, he was an honest man. LBJ sent our fighting men BACK to Nam. JFK was pulling them out. The rules of engagement,, REALLY, you're in a place where people are shooting at you, you get in a spot where you can surprise them and kill them, but some idiot who isn't in any danger is setting up Rules of Engagement that make Your survival less likely.
@Justin: No, I believe the fault lies mainly with LBJ and the "whiz kids" he inherited from JFK. They all thought they were smart enough to play military commander when they were clearly out of their depth. A lesson Hitler failed to learn (thankfully) and one Stalin initially didn't learn either. Once Stalin understood he was part of the problem, he pulled back and let those trained to fight wars do what they were trained to do. The same with LBJ. Put it another way, can you imagine FDR and or Churchill deciding what the next day's military targets were to be?
I'm not that educated in history. I really don't know what other leaders did. I may be wrong about what I believe about lbj. I just believe he was a huge crook and a horrible person. And I have heard that his wife whose name I will not say, owned some of the troop ships that hauled our people to Nam to run through a grinder that made so many people rich. Not trying to frustrate or argue, just offered my take.
David Halberstam's The Best and the Brightest tried to canonize JFK and I think became the "what really happened" as JFK was being raised to god status. I didn't see JFK as being any less a warhawk on Vietnam than anyone else in the government at the time. I remember, while serving in Vietnam, that Lady Bird was supposed to be a major stockholder in Alaska Barge which did a bit of work in Vietnam. She was also rumored to be a stockholder in Pacific Architects and Engineers (PA&E) there.
LBJ was no saint, but neither was JFK. And I helped campaign for Kennedy.
It's easy to blame Democrats for 1975 debacle in Vietnam, especially after Congress (led by Ted Kennedy) voted to suspend all aid to the Republic of Vietnam in DEC 1974. But reality is that the "peace" negotiated by President Nixon was little more than a fig leaf to allow America to withdraw. The 1973 peace treaty called for all foreign troops to be withdrawn from RVN, all foreign troops except for PAVN (the North Vietnamese Army) that is. While supposedly bound by the ceasefire, PAVN was allowed to remain in the areas of RVN that they controlled. The ceasefire was overseen by a force composed of troops from Hungary, Poland, Canada and Indonesia. Within days of the ceasefire these troops stopped monitoring the areas controlled by PAVN because their helicopters routinely took fire when flying over PAVN controlled areas. I burn with shame when I think about how we betrayed RVN and abandoned them to the communists.
If there's any upside to any of this, at least when the next time some hopelessly ignorant Progressive kid whines about how awful is is in America for women and the LGBTQWERTY crowd, we can easily respond, "Well, at least we aren't Afghanistan".
I'm of the generation that watched the 'Nam War on television, and I remember as well as anyone else the insane rout out of Saigon played over the air. So, the feeling of déjà vu is overwhelming.
That said, the uncounted tens of thousands of Vietnamese who tried to flee after we had pulled out at least had access to the sea and could--however desperately--at least attempt an escape. How many perished miserably at sea, unseen and unknown, can't even be guessed at. Yet, of the many thousands who did make it to The States, the vast majority became patriotic citizens who, after an inevitably painful period of adjustment, all settled in with remarkably high degree of success. Far from becoming "burdensome refugees," they became wealth producing, tax paying citizens. A remarkable number of these settled in my native Oklahoma City (similar hot, humid summers?) and have elevated the community. Visit our "Little Saigon" if you wish to see what hard working, grateful refugees can accomplish in a single generation!
But, what about the Afghans who, if possible, face a far more certain future of extermination and subjugation at the hands of the Taliban Cave Men than the South Vietnamese ever did from the Communists? They have no ocean to turn to, however desperately, being surrounded by more enemies of the US and the West in general. Those comparatively few who may escape in the next few days must be given all the protection and aid this country can afford--assuming we wish to salvage any part of our national honor after the feckless abandonment of them and their cause.
But too many Americans, it seems, may be inclined to see these new refugees not as former allies, but "Just more Muslims/Ragheads/Jihadists" when they are, in fact people who embraced what the West had to offer. It doesn't help that our "President" has just tarred them with the brush of being cowards and ingrates, either.
I don't know how well these new refugees will fare here, but I wish them well and encourage the rest of us to cut them some slack as they try to adjust--which will be harder than hell.
Remember, someday some of US may have to flee our former homes and seek safety in another country thanks to the new Taliban of The Woke frantically trying to make the world their own.
I worked for many years with a VN gal who was on one of the last helicopters out. She had the baby in her arms and the clothes she was wearing. She was sponsored by one of our pathologists, and started as a bottle washer in the lab. That little girl of hers is now a Phd in aeronautical engineering.
They are one of the largest assembly of chicken-shits known to the world! What is causing them to duck and run for cover? Oh no, it's those smelly Walmart people!!!
Decided to tune into the Fox News Bret Bier show after many years of not watching it and it is a crying shame Dr. Krauthammer is no longer with us, for I would have loved to hear his take on the political and humanitarian disaster the Obama sock puppet president has let happen.
The Islamic nations have been fighting each other for 1500 years but have ignored Afghanistan because no nation has ever won a war with Afghanistan. Their tribes have been fighting each other for 1500 years but prefer to use strangers for target practice.
We have nothing they want and have nothing we want . . . except opium. The US military-industrial complex gets richer and only US volunteers die there. The war is a win-win "war" except for the families of GIs who get killed . . . and paid volunteers.
@bill wald said "We have nothing they want and have nothing we want.
Except perhaps rare earth minerals that we're gonna needs for all of these EVs, windmills & solar panels the Democrats will be forcing on us. Except China & Russia to be in Afghanistan by the end of the decade extracting them.
Some things make my jaw drop; reading how the Brits are running rescue ops in Kabul and the CinC won't allow the US troops to go into Kabul...the Brits are understandably irate with us...I am so ashamed.
WaPo: Taliban gets a voice on Twitter because they ‘play by the rules’, unlike Trump
The same mainstream media outlet that faced backlash for lamenting the death of “austere religious scholar” Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi is now facing backlash for drawing attention to the Taliban’s “sophisticated” use of social media.
Presidense Biden got that statement wrong , too. The "…unwilling to fight for themselves." statement. Afghan forces fighting the Taliban have lost 56-58,000 men and more men each year than American forces have lost in 20 years. So Presidense Biden statement shows you just how much in the dark are his statements. Let's hope Presidense Biden can utter one truthful statement each week. I understand the meme but the quote is out of place with characters on the floor in the House. unless misinformation was the point and a look at more liars.
Newsflash: Passed-out man in car had 300 mail-in California recall ballots, guns, drugs and stolen credit cards.
My tweet on the above
“Secure elections my ass.”
Tune then: Thanks for the memories – Bob Hope theme tune Tune now: Thanks for the comedy – all the douche bags that voted against Trump.
Funny Email: We see North Korean leader Kim Il Jung smiling. The caption? ”I no longer craziest leader---LOL.”
To the tune Thanks for the Memories
Thanks for the comedy. Keep it going all you LIBS got DIS'ed due all your FIBS Inflation high only CRAP JOBS are you watching this? Next election, you'll get DIS'd
Way, to go Sleepy Joe. Obama said it best Joe can create a mess Gays and women in blood they're swimm'in Taliban's swords they won't miss heads and bodies food for fish.
Newsflash: Joe Biden will campaign for Gavin Newsome, the California governor of a state so screwed up that they just called for a recall election.
Finish this one: You know you're NOT a California democrat anymore after you______? See homeless alcoholics and drug addicts taking turns collectively shitting on your front yard all hours of the day and night.
To the tune Cheer Up Sleepy Jean
Things were going great. Our commerce it was top rate. Border was secured Crime was LOW.
Trump exposed LIB'S FIBS and for that got rid of him. Now turn on TV LIBS now shout OH NO!
Way to go Sleepy Joe. Inflation it was low and the border was secure and Covid only fear. CHICOM techs then made, a virus that made LIB'S DAY. To take out Muslims in China's north.
Virus it escaped and world flat lined every day, as the LIBS all HIGH FIVED. Got their way.
Way to go SLEEPY JOE Bugged out of Afghanistan and didn't have a single plan folks there are now damned.
Way to go Sleepy Joe, ALLAH AKBAR as Gays and women's their HEADS WILL ROLL Taking their toll.
Nice one Sleepy Joe. Debt now thirty TRILL! As we deal with depression and need A BIG HAPPY PILL.
Hooray SLEEPY JOE! We might get over it as we get ready to eat kernels corn FROM OUR SHIT!
Cheer up LIBERAL WHORES! You're verifying this if you vote against someone as opposed to voting FOR!
Nice one sleepy Joe. Taliban has our gear maybe they will attack Red China SUM of all FEARS.
31 comments:
As always, your posts are razor sharp in skewering/ridiculing the intended target
Lyndon Johnson said pretty much the same thing (with the same outcome); American boys shouldn't be fighting a war Asian boys should be fighting.
After the way we pulled out of Bagram in the dead of night without telling the Afghans, the handwriting on was on the wall. Even so, the ARVN certainly acquitted themselves better than the ANA.
As for the clown show in Washington...
https://sta.sh/01ba06xkqhog
'Nuff said.
I'm saying that the death toll between American citizens and Afghans will approach one mullion. And buck fiden should be held accountable. "Nuff said.
million
@pkdphd - First, LBJ was the one who committed hundreds of thousands of American boys to the fight in Vietnam. Second, you should have been there during the Easter offensive in 1972; the ARVN fought like tigers. In 1975 after America had cut off all support for the Republic of Vietnam, even ammunition and spare parts (in direct violation of our treaty obligations) it was different, but it still took 5 months for the PAVN (with tanks and plenty of artillery) to take Saigon.
"In 1975 after America had cut off all support for the Republic of Vietnam"
Believe it was the democrats who did this.
I had a friend who served in Korea and Nam. He was a solid Democrat. He had a newspaper front page tacked to a wall and it declared that America lost and pointed out why the loss was on the democrats. Yeah, that's right,, he was an honest man.
LBJ sent our fighting men BACK to Nam. JFK was pulling them out.
The rules of engagement,, REALLY, you're in a place where people are shooting at you, you get in a spot where you can surprise them and kill them, but some idiot who isn't in any danger is setting up Rules of Engagement that make Your survival less likely.
Is it just me or is that stupid?
@Justin: No, I believe the fault lies mainly with LBJ and the "whiz kids" he inherited from JFK. They all thought they were smart enough to play military commander when they were clearly out of their depth. A lesson Hitler failed to learn (thankfully) and one Stalin initially didn't learn either. Once Stalin understood he was part of the problem, he pulled back and let those trained to fight wars do what they were trained to do. The same with LBJ. Put it another way, can you imagine FDR and or Churchill deciding what the next day's military targets were to be?
I'm not that educated in history. I really don't know what other leaders did. I may be wrong about what I believe about lbj. I just believe he was a huge crook and a horrible person. And I have heard that his wife whose name I will not say, owned some of the troop ships that hauled our people to Nam to run through a grinder that made so many people rich.
Not trying to frustrate or argue, just offered my take.
David Halberstam's The Best and the Brightest tried to canonize JFK and I think became the "what really happened" as JFK was being raised to god status.
I didn't see JFK as being any less a warhawk on Vietnam than anyone else in the government at the time.
I remember, while serving in Vietnam, that Lady Bird was supposed to be a major stockholder in Alaska Barge which did a bit of work in Vietnam. She was also rumored to be a stockholder in Pacific Architects and Engineers (PA&E) there.
LBJ was no saint, but neither was JFK. And I helped campaign for Kennedy.
It's easy to blame Democrats for 1975 debacle in Vietnam, especially after Congress (led by Ted Kennedy) voted to suspend all aid to the Republic of Vietnam in DEC 1974. But reality is that the "peace" negotiated by President Nixon was little more than a fig leaf to allow America to withdraw. The 1973 peace treaty called for all foreign troops to be withdrawn from RVN, all foreign troops except for PAVN (the North Vietnamese Army) that is. While supposedly bound by the ceasefire, PAVN was allowed to remain in the areas of RVN that they controlled. The ceasefire was overseen by a force composed of troops from Hungary, Poland, Canada and Indonesia. Within days of the ceasefire these troops stopped monitoring the areas controlled by PAVN because their helicopters routinely took fire when flying over PAVN controlled areas. I burn with shame when I think about how we betrayed RVN and abandoned them to the communists.
Zing!
More proof that Progressivism is a mental illness:
State Department calls for Taliban to include women in its government
That's sweet. Because if the Taliban is known for anything, it's supporting female empowerment.
I also doubt we'll be seeing any more flags flown during "Pride Month" in Afghanistan.
If there's any upside to any of this, at least when the next time some hopelessly ignorant Progressive kid whines about how awful is is in America for women and the LGBTQWERTY crowd, we can easily respond, "Well, at least we aren't Afghanistan".
I'm of the generation that watched the 'Nam War on television, and I remember as well as anyone else the insane rout out of Saigon played over the air. So, the feeling of déjà vu is overwhelming.
That said, the uncounted tens of thousands of Vietnamese who tried to flee after we had pulled out at least had access to the sea and could--however desperately--at least attempt an escape. How many perished miserably at sea, unseen and unknown, can't even be guessed at. Yet, of the many thousands who did make it to The States, the vast majority became patriotic citizens who, after an inevitably painful period of adjustment, all settled in with remarkably high degree of success. Far from becoming "burdensome refugees," they became wealth producing, tax paying citizens. A remarkable number of these settled in my native Oklahoma City (similar hot, humid summers?) and have elevated the community. Visit our "Little Saigon" if you wish to see what hard working, grateful refugees can accomplish in a single generation!
But, what about the Afghans who, if possible, face a far more certain future of extermination and subjugation at the hands of the Taliban Cave Men than the South Vietnamese ever did from the Communists? They have no ocean to turn to, however desperately, being surrounded by more enemies of the US and the West in general. Those comparatively few who may escape in the next few days must be given all the protection and aid this country can afford--assuming we wish to salvage any part of our national honor after the feckless abandonment of them and their cause.
But too many Americans, it seems, may be inclined to see these new refugees not as former allies, but "Just more Muslims/Ragheads/Jihadists" when they are, in fact people who embraced what the West had to offer. It doesn't help that our "President" has just tarred them with the brush of being cowards and ingrates, either.
I don't know how well these new refugees will fare here, but I wish them well and encourage the rest of us to cut them some slack as they try to adjust--which will be harder than hell.
Remember, someday some of US may have to flee our former homes and seek safety in another country thanks to the new Taliban of The Woke frantically trying to make the world their own.
TVAG
I worked for many years with a VN gal who was on one of the last helicopters out. She had the baby in her arms and the clothes she was wearing. She was sponsored by one of our pathologists, and started as a bottle washer in the lab. That little girl of hers is now a Phd in aeronautical engineering.
Stilt, when you're right, you're oh, so RIGHT!
They are one of the largest assembly of chicken-shits known to the world! What is causing them to duck and run for cover? Oh no, it's those smelly Walmart people!!!
Rep Crenshaw lays out the real reason we were there, has nothing to do with doing their fighting for them.
https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.foxnews.com%2Fmedia%2Fdan-crenshaw-afghanistan-real-world-dangerous-biden-incompetence%3Ffbclid%3DIwAR1udAKkJmyjLcrz67vEhnpdJnxsQtGoI3VACGwL-ORe9JuiJrC6QSUF7CU&h=AT04lFtJhT0PNa-Nd8vUTfXjE6bu1d5CbV6xHKDuNl0vkScbQl9gNQxFuzcoR4IsemTYsuZu_usbtzUtyNSd6GWlllJoGld6zTQ16wAZyrOgk2i0cnhX9SHUPA4pJ1IDienMfGDLXpdl-m_AqQ&__tn__=-UK-R&c[0]=AT1le4sW51kPB-xWuj3aW5JTkbqUjm73citN4skhKr8qcXN1DA_dEZhgWdEc__HlKGUj2uiIDjWFlyYQ0PkVJyantdjmaPZJB-QnbCr3jCiBskdpY8V26vChxLAxxnju_FW30DMa7qgZpcM3WRpWzHWYrUM
As crappy as all of this is, don't, DON'T, forget all the audits going on in the USA !
Decided to tune into the Fox News Bret Bier show after many years of not watching it and it is a crying shame Dr. Krauthammer is no longer with us, for I would have loved to hear his take on the political and humanitarian disaster the Obama sock puppet president has let happen.
Can I paraphrase Bidens line for another problem? Why should we still be giving them WELFARE if they will not help themselves?
Well, there's some joy,
https://www.weaselzippers.us/473274-someone-hacked-bulletin-boards-and-put-up-hilarious-pictures-of-saigon-joe/
The Islamic nations have been fighting each other for 1500 years but have ignored Afghanistan because no nation has ever won a war with Afghanistan. Their tribes have been fighting each other for 1500 years but prefer to use strangers for target practice.
We have nothing they want and have nothing we want . . . except opium. The US military-industrial complex gets richer and only US volunteers die there. The war is a win-win "war" except for the families of GIs who get killed . . . and paid volunteers.
@bill wald said "We have nothing they want and have nothing we want.
Except perhaps rare earth minerals that we're gonna needs for all of these EVs, windmills & solar panels the Democrats will be forcing on us. Except China & Russia to be in Afghanistan by the end of the decade extracting them.
Whenever I hear the term "rules of engagement" I think of the Butch Cassidy knife fight scene.
Well don't forget, Nancy had her shoe ready.
Some things make my jaw drop; reading how the Brits are running rescue ops in Kabul and the CinC won't allow the US troops to go into Kabul...the Brits are understandably irate with us...I am so ashamed.
https://www.bizpacreview.com/2021/08/19/wapo-taliban-gets-a-voice-on-twitter-because-they-play-by-the-rules-unlike-trump-1121218/?utm_medium=Newsletter&utm_source=Get+Response&utm_term=EMAIL&utm_content=Newsletter&utm_campaign=bizpac
WaPo: Taliban gets a voice on Twitter because they ‘play by the rules’, unlike Trump
The same mainstream media outlet that faced backlash for lamenting the death of “austere religious scholar” Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi is now facing backlash for drawing attention to the Taliban’s “sophisticated” use of social media.
Presidense Biden got that statement wrong , too. The "…unwilling to fight for themselves." statement. Afghan forces fighting the Taliban have lost 56-58,000 men and more men each year than American forces have lost in 20 years. So Presidense Biden statement shows you just how much in the dark are his statements. Let's hope Presidense Biden can utter one truthful statement each week.
I understand the meme but the quote is out of place with characters on the floor in the House. unless misinformation was the point and a look at more liars.
Talk about something utterly hateful
https://www.facebook.com/plugins/post.php?href=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Fredmondkr%2Fposts%2F10220669009779209&show_text=true&width=500" width="500" height="498" style="border:none;overflow:hidden" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true" allow="autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; picture-in-picture; web-share"></
Newsflash: Passed-out man in car had 300 mail-in California recall ballots, guns, drugs and stolen credit cards.
My tweet on the above
“Secure elections my ass.”
Tune then: Thanks for the memories – Bob Hope theme tune
Tune now: Thanks for the comedy – all the douche bags that voted against Trump.
Funny Email: We see North Korean leader Kim Il Jung smiling. The caption?
”I no longer craziest leader---LOL.”
To the tune Thanks for the Memories
Thanks
for the comedy.
Keep it going all you LIBS
got DIS'ed
due all your FIBS
Inflation high
only CRAP JOBS
are you
watching this?
Next election,
you'll get DIS'd
Way,
to go
Sleepy Joe.
Obama said it best
Joe can create a mess
Gays and women
in blood they're swimm'in
Taliban's swords
they won't miss
heads and bodies
food for fish.
Newsflash: Joe Biden will campaign for Gavin Newsome, the California governor of a state so screwed up that they just called for a recall election.
Finish this one: You know you're NOT a California democrat anymore after
you______?
See homeless alcoholics and drug addicts taking turns collectively shitting on
your front yard all hours of the day and night.
To the tune Cheer Up Sleepy Jean
Things were going great.
Our commerce it was
top rate.
Border was secured
Crime was LOW.
Trump exposed LIB'S FIBS
and for that
got rid of him.
Now turn on TV
LIBS
now shout
OH NO!
Way to go Sleepy Joe.
Inflation it was low
and
the border was secure
and
Covid
only fear.
CHICOM techs then made,
a virus that made LIB'S DAY.
To take out Muslims in
China's north.
Virus it escaped
and world flat lined every day,
as the LIBS all
HIGH FIVED.
Got their way.
Way to go SLEEPY JOE
Bugged out of
Afghanistan
and
didn't have
a single plan
folks
there
are now damned.
Way to go Sleepy Joe,
ALLAH AKBAR
as
Gays
and women's
their HEADS WILL ROLL
Taking their toll.
Nice one Sleepy Joe.
Debt now thirty TRILL!
As we
deal with depression
and need
A BIG HAPPY PILL.
Hooray SLEEPY JOE!
We might get over it
as we
get ready to eat
kernels
corn
FROM OUR SHIT!
Cheer up LIBERAL WHORES!
You're verifying this
if you
vote against someone
as opposed
to
voting FOR!
Nice one sleepy Joe.
Taliban has our gear
maybe
they will attack Red China
SUM
of all FEARS.
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